Posts by Bungi Bill

57

Attention Lurkers- Consider the effectiveness of your lifesaving work

by stuckinamovement in

jw
friends

hypothetical scenario.

you are a city manager in a major metropolitan city with a population of 3,000,000.. .

if the governing body was truly convinced themselves of the impending disaster and the fact that the end is imminent would they not focus their efforts in spreading the message through effective means such as telephone, television, internet, social networks etc?

Bungi Bill

All I can say is I am thankful that, during a bushfire alert around here, the emergency services don't send their workers around going door to door to warn people when it is time to evacuate!

Rather, radio and TV alerts are sent out well in advance:

- then when it comes time to evacuate, the loud hailers on the emergency service's vehicles issue the actual order.

Of course, if there is no real emergency after all, then the blunt instrument of sending an army of bloody fools out to knock on doors of (mainly) empty houses won't actually cause any deaths!

Bill.

67

Do you detect an underlying sadness ?

by Phizzy in

jw
friends

whenever i talk to jw's, and even in some of the jw official videos, i detect a definite vibe of sadness coming off these people.. i am very sensitive to "atmospheres" and to peoples emotional state, you wouldn't think so, because more often than not i do not react to what i detect, i just let people get on with it.. but i do get this feeling that they are sad, probably because very, very, very deep down they realise that it is all false, maybe ?.

Bungi Bill

3rdgen,

You've nailed it there!

The very one and only instance in which 3 really equals 4

i.e. in the JW world, a three letter word called "FUN" actually has four letters - not three.

They certainly don't want their R&F experiencing that:

- and it shows all too clearly!

Bill.

67

Do you detect an underlying sadness ?

by Phizzy in

jw
friends

whenever i talk to jw's, and even in some of the jw official videos, i detect a definite vibe of sadness coming off these people.. i am very sensitive to "atmospheres" and to peoples emotional state, you wouldn't think so, because more often than not i do not react to what i detect, i just let people get on with it.. but i do get this feeling that they are sad, probably because very, very, very deep down they realise that it is all false, maybe ?.

Bungi Bill

3rdgen,

You've nailed it there!

The very one and only instance in which 3 really equals 4

i.e. in the JW world, a three letter word called "FUN" actually has four letters - not three.

They certainly don't want their R&F experiencing that:

- and it shows all too clearly!

Bill.

67

Do you detect an underlying sadness ?

by Phizzy in

jw
friends

whenever i talk to jw's, and even in some of the jw official videos, i detect a definite vibe of sadness coming off these people.. i am very sensitive to "atmospheres" and to peoples emotional state, you wouldn't think so, because more often than not i do not react to what i detect, i just let people get on with it.. but i do get this feeling that they are sad, probably because very, very, very deep down they realise that it is all false, maybe ?.

Bungi Bill

Certainly their heart does not seem to be in it - i.e their door to door ministry - anymore.

I see this with nearly all the ones that have called at my place over the last five or so years, anyway. They go about their business in the most perfunctory of manner, radiating the aura that they are there only so that they can enter a few "hours" on their Field Service Report for the month, and thus not feel too guilty about things.

Then, if they do meet somebody at the doors who even hints at being perhaps a little too hot to handle, they (the JWs) seem all too happy to have an excuse for disengaging the enemy and fleeing the field!

And, yeah, all along with a facial expression that communicates everything but being happy about what they are doing.

I cannot but contrast this with the spirit of most JWs 40+ years ago, who relished the thought of getting into a verbal sparring session with others.

My observations, anyway!

Bill.

65

1975 - The Killer WT quote

by tim hooper in

one thing is absolutely certain, bible chronology reinforced with fulfilled bible prophecy shows that six thousand years of mans existence will soon be up, yes, within this generation!

(matt.

24:34) this is, therefore, no time to be indifferent and complacent.

Bungi Bill

All interesting observations about how they (the WTS) all but said outright that the world was going to end in 1975. Certainly that thought was left hanging there - repeatedly - and it was patently obvious that they wanted us to believe 1975 would see Armegeddon.

As to their sincerity, though (or lack of it!);

- I do somehow get the feeling that F.W. Franz, deluded bloody fool and orchestrator of this whole debacle, probably came to believe this nonsense himself.

This might be time for somebody like Steve2 to comment about how, if someone keeps spouting lies for long enough, they can end up believing these themselves?

Bill.

33

Ray Franz blamed for 1975 false prophecy

by EndofMysteries in

i was raised a jw and as a kid my family made brief mention of apostates in bethel that falsely prophecied about 1975 and were kicked out of bethel.

i was shocked after i got out and learned that him being removed had absolutely nothing to do with 1975. i think that partial lie spread is what kept my relatives in.

1975 a big let down/false prophecy, then they are told that a governing body member and many in bethel are found apostate and cleaned out, etc.

Bungi Bill

I would have to say that there were rumours circulating in the mid-1980s that the 1975 business was the doing of "apostates". (Well, I certainly heard these, anyway!)

This was closely followed by further rumours about those who left Bethel / were expelled from Bethel to the effect that they had been also invlolved in some homosexual scandal. Both claims, of course, were completely slanderous!

Bill

18

Are JW:s more sick than others

by Bugbear in

on request from friends thread i would like to tell you my story.

the subject from friends thread was simply : are jw,s more negative or more disordered than normal people?.

i was 10 15 years ago an elder.

Bungi Bill

I noticed an extraordinary amount of Chronic Fatigue Syndrome (CFS / ME /Tapanui Flu - call it what you like!) amongst the JWs. Its sufferers included some who were still only in their early teens. This condition was so prevalent amongst the congregations that 5% of the circuit was affected (figures compiled in 1990)

Also, long serving "Pioneers", or others engaged in full time service , seemed to be disproportionally represented amongst those diagnosed with the condition.

Significantly, in the nearly 20 years now since I bid that bloody lot goodbye, I have not known anybody - not even one person - who is suffering from CFS.

There is still some considerable debate in the medical community as to whether CFS is a medical or psychological illness. Could it be our body's way of telling us "Please stop, I have been driven too hard for far too long without letup":

- and being a typical guilt-ridden JW whose best efforts are still never quite enough, the only tolerated excuse for easing off the accelerator pedal is a chronic illness?

Bill

PS: My wife and two teenage daughters were both incapacitated with this complaint all at the same time.

65

1975 - The Killer WT quote

by tim hooper in

one thing is absolutely certain, bible chronology reinforced with fulfilled bible prophecy shows that six thousand years of mans existence will soon be up, yes, within this generation!

(matt.

24:34) this is, therefore, no time to be indifferent and complacent.

Bungi Bill

I have heard a number (both JWs and ex-JWs) who were around in those times now claim that they "never believed anything about 1975."

Significantly, though, during those years leading up to '75 (and I started associating with the JWs in 1969) I heard not one JW express any such sentiment. To have done so would have got you branded as "immature".

So those of you that now reckon you didn't buy it after all, I have trouble believing your claim!

Bill.

33

Ray Franz blamed for 1975 false prophecy

by EndofMysteries in

i was raised a jw and as a kid my family made brief mention of apostates in bethel that falsely prophecied about 1975 and were kicked out of bethel.

i was shocked after i got out and learned that him being removed had absolutely nothing to do with 1975. i think that partial lie spread is what kept my relatives in.

1975 a big let down/false prophecy, then they are told that a governing body member and many in bethel are found apostate and cleaned out, etc.

Bungi Bill

They started touting 1975 in 1966, with the realease of the book Life Everlasting in Freedom of the Sons of God. (The offending words may be found on page 29 of that book. ) This happened at least five years before Raymond Franz was appointed to the GB.

No, the 1975 debacle originated with his uncle, the WTS's resident madman theologian , Frederick Franz. (FW Franz wrote all their books in those years. This showed up in his writing style, as well as in his kooky ideas!)

When 1975 proved to be a non-event, the WTS then tried to blame it on just about everbody but the actual culprit.

All this reminds me of the typical six stages of a project:

1) Wild enthusiasm

2) Deep despair

3) Panic

4) Search for the guilty

5) Punishment of the innocent

6) Promotion for those not involved.

Although this saying was intended to be presented in a tongue in cheek manner only, I still do believe we saw all six stages happen amongst the JWs over the matter of 1975!

Bill.

21

This website finally helped me understand the claim of 100% failure rate

by ILoveTTATT in

jw
friends

up to about 5 minutes ago... i still had the notion that maybe jw's predicted something and got it right... that the league of nations was going to rise and become the united nations.

i think that jw prophecies/predictions are like a shotgun: shoots many projectiles, one of them has got to hit.

you cannot predict 5 different things and then, when one of them gets partly fulfilled, drop the other 4.5 things, change the 1/2 thing you predicted that was right and make it seem like that was the only thing you predicted, and make the entire one point fit after the fact.. reading watchtower literature throughout the years (1879 till now), and then coming here and getting awesome explanations from people like leolaia and other researchers, i finally understand the claim that most apostate websites make: the wt has a 100% prediction failure rate.. they were lucky that something big happened in 1914... but now i am much wiser and i know that everything they predicted for 1914 did not turn out as they predicted... 1914 has been a date with many different hats... from the start of armageddon, to the beginning of the last days... etc.... thank you very much jwn for completely opening my mind.

Bungi Bill

"You cannot predict 5 different things and then, when one of them gets partly fulfilled, drop the other 4.5 things, change the 1/2 thing you predicted that was right and make it seem like that was the only thing you predicted, and make the entire one point fit AFTER the fact."

ILove TTATT:

-you nailed it in a nutshell, like I have never seen before!

Bill.